Apparently VERY Bad News for EBR

[Scott]

With the Cleveland Cyclewerks rumors that have been floating around, I decided to play around and make a map that combines the Cleveland Cyclewerks (blue) and EBR(red) dealers:



I have to say, I don't know if there's anything to it, but it makes a lot of sense. In addition to creating one medium dealer network from two small ones (assuming you could get most dealers to sign on), it would give Cleveland Cyclewerks a boost and greatly help them create the "American" image they're clearly going for, while giving EBR a low-cost bike and something to do while they're waiting for demand for the big bikes to pick up.

As long as there's someone with enough money and vision to put it all together.

[Scott]

Imagine this bike:





Being made in East Troy and being called the "EBR Blast" instead of being made in China and being called the Cleveland Cyclewerks Misfit. Would there be a bigger interest in it? I suspect so. I gotta admit, I'm a sucker for a kick-starter.

...

[1190SX]

Imagine this bike:





Being made in East Troy and being called the "EBR Blast" instead of being made in China and being called the Cleveland Cyclewerks Misfit. Would there be a bigger interest in it? I suspect so. I gotta admit, I'm a sucker for a kick-starter.

...

I'll stick with Polaris. They should buy the brand and start with marketing. I'm going to throw this out there: maybe even make it a new Indian model to attract other riders to Indian that don't want a 600lbs+ cruiser. I don't want some China garbage technology even if EBR takes it over and starts making it. Enzo Ferrari can take a dump, that doesn't make it a pile of gold. EBR is nearly unknown, Cleveland CycleWerks is unknown and would probably tank EBR even faster upon a reboot. Want to make EBR work? Going to have to start out again by designing a damn hipster bike, sorry folks I hate them too, but they are selling more than anything else in the market. Triumph's sales are up 90%, guess what they are selling? Hipster bikes, not Street Triples or Daytona's.

[Hughlysses]

Who knows what Polaris will do with Indian, but if it's anything other than build more cruisers and touring bikes I'll be damn surprised. They just made a big move to consolidate their models and operations; I can't imagine they'd have any interest in taking on EBR.

You say they need a hipster bike; the Misfit has hipster written all over it. Imagine it with an EBR-designed, US built 250 engine like the one EBR designed for the Hero HX250R.

We also know EBR has a sub-$10k, probably mid-displacement bike almost ready to go. Cleveland's existing models combined with a middleweight combined with the 1190's would be a pretty comprehensive model lineup.

Scott- those dealer networks are about as "complimentary" as I could imagine. I could really see an amalgamation of the two companies working.

[1190SX]

Who knows what Polaris will do with Indian, but if it's anything other than build more cruisers and touring bikes I'll be damn surprised. They just made a big move to consolidate their models and operations; I can't imagine they'd have any interest in taking on EBR.

You say they need a hipster bike; the Misfit has hipster written all over it. Imagine it with an EBR-designed, US built 250 engine like the one EBR designed for the Hero HX250R.

We also know EBR has a sub-$10k, probably mid-displacement bike almost ready to go. Cleveland's existing models combined with a middleweight combined with the 1190's would be a pretty comprehensive model lineup.

Scott- those dealer networks are about as "complimentary" as I could imagine. I could really see an amalgamation of the two companies working.

I have no problem with an EBR design, if it is just that. That would pretty much mean the Cleveland brand's only value would be monetary backing. As far as I am concerned they may bring some hipster creativity to the table for the hipster bike designs(which aint hard to be honest), but as far as engineering and r&d they should probably take a back seat, or better yet stay home. Whether or not Polaris or Indian would have any interest is up for debate, but highly unlikely given the circumstances. Part of EBRs marketing has consistently been Made in the USA, the American Superbike, I can almost guarantee you that 99% of us bought them for this reason. If that is your platform, be careful going into business with companies who don't share the same vision and are primarily concerned with making poor quality cheap chinese bikes.

[Kid Thunder]

You also miss 2 in NH & 1 in Maine which will cover New England.

[Scott]

So it seems like from this and other bits and pieces around the web, Bruce will be the CCW manufacturer in the US. I would assume that a week ago his plan was to make the bikes in his NJ facility.

Will the EBR announcement change things? If I were Bruce, I would certainly be interested in buying EBR and combining resources if at all possible. Can he get the key components of EBR and make EBR's in NJ as Well? That would seem a nice way to have a much broader line of motorcycles to offer.

Will he use the facilities in East Troy and have them make both bikes? That's another possibility.

If it were me, I'd use my own facilities. EBR's problem is they can't sell enough bikes to keep the factory running. Bruce wouldn't have that problem. He has a manufacturing operation that can sustain itself - without building a single motorcycle.

He could start very slow - let's say 400 CCW's and 200 EBR's per year to start. He wouldn't need to push to get bikes out to market because the company wouldn't shut down and people wouldn't have to be laid off if bike sales were slow. He could just shift resources to other manufacturing at his facility.

It will be interesting to see what happens in any case.

[1190SX]

I'm glad I already got mine if CCW is going to be in on it. Companies utilizing chinese manufacturing for motorcycles have consistently shown they are concerned with quantity not quality. At this point I could see EBR calling it quits rather than partner with a company that has a completely opposite vision. Made in USA, creating American jobs, quality first VS. American owned company, made in china, lets make stuff super cheap low quality and sell a ton. Why not just cut out the middle man and sell EBR to a chinese company and start making them in china? You honestly think just because some new owner is in charge they will stop using chinese components and cut chinese manufacturing ties? They already have the business network set-up in china because they have been doing it that way. Tearing up the current business model of CCW would be paramount to financial suicide, you might as well start a completely new company and forget about CCW. At best, they will start assembling them here. In the quotes you cited Belfer states, "the Big Four Japanese have recalls..." in defense to someone calling CCW lemons. Comparing CCW to Honda, Yamaha, etc is a bit of a stretch. All manufacturing has the potential for rare defects and indeed all manufacturers have been guilty of overlooking flaws that later result in recalls. That being said, there is a distinct difference between having incidences of manufacturing defects and knowingly manufacturing poor quality in a 3rd world country to make a buck in the USA. Business is business, and no doubt Erik Buell is also a business man, but he is also person of integrity that has demonstrated to me that he values American craftsmanship, quality, and supporting his fellow Americans. Perhaps this has contributed to his many trials and tribulations, it is a much easier road if you put making a buck before all else.

[Scott]

I'm glad I already got mine if CCW is going to be in on it. Companies utilizing chinese manufacturing for motorcycles have consistently shown they are concerned with quantity not quality. At this point I could see EBR calling it quits rather than partner with a company that has a completely opposite vision. Made in USA, creating American jobs, quality first VS. American owned company, made in china, lets make stuff super cheap low quality and sell a ton. Why not just cut out the middle man and sell EBR to a chinese company and start making them in china? You honestly think just because some new owner is in charge they will stop using chinese components and cut chinese manufacturing ties? They already have the business network set-up in china because they have been doing it that way. Tearing up the current business model of CCW would be paramount to financial suicide, you might as well start a completely new company and forget about CCW. At best, they will start assembling them here. In the quotes you cited Belfer states, "the Big Four Japanese have recalls..." in defense to someone calling CCW lemons. Comparing CCW to Honda, Yamaha, etc is a bit of a stretch. All manufacturing has the potential for rare defects and indeed all manufacturers have been guilty of overlooking flaws that later result in recalls. That being said, there is a distinct difference between having incidences of manufacturing defects and knowingly manufacturing poor quality in a 3rd world country to make a buck in the USA. Business is business, and no doubt Erik Buell is also a business man, but he is also person of integrity that has demonstrated to me that he values American craftsmanship, quality, and supporting his fellow Americans. Perhaps this has contributed to his many trials and tribulations, it is a much easier road if you put making a buck before all else.

Your concerns are valid, but what we might ideally want and what might actually happen could be two different things. If CCW says to LAP, "We'll give you $1,000,000 for all the IP and rights to make EBR motorcycles." Would LAP take it? Probably. Would CCW offer it? If they have the cash (and I suspect they have some Chinese money behind them), I think it would make some sense. So it could be a done deal whether we like it or not.

I know that if I were CCW and I had issues with the way people perceived my company (as a distributor of cheap Chinese junk), I would be VERY interested in obtaining EBR's IP and rights. We already know CCW is trying to repair their image and want to be able to claim to be an American company by moving production to the US. If I were CCW, I would buy the EBR rights and then re-brand the small bikes as EBR.

EBR may not have a great reputation themselves, but they are generally known and admired in the motorcycle world as innovators (and perhaps more importantly an American brand). There are certainly far more people who know EBR (for better or worse) than know CCW.

So like it or not, I wouldn't be surprised if CCW buys the EBR rights and starts selling the Chinese bikes as EBR's alongside the EBR 1190's.

I'm not going to go as far as saying it's 'likely', but LAP is clearly looking for buyers and since we know Bruce was interested in EBR in the past and since we know Bruce is now involved with CCW, and since we know that EBR has some assets that CCW could use, I don't think it's crazy to think this could be where we're headed.

[Hughlysses]

Action Powersports just posted fire sale prices on remaining 2016 models: $9999 for RX, $8999 for SX, and they do have a warranty.